PARLIAMENTARY DEBATE
UK Infrastructure Bank Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) - 22 November 2022 (Commons/Public Bill Committees)
Debate Detail
Chair(s) † Mr Peter Bone, Geraint Davies
Members† Fletcher, Katherine (South Ribble) (Con)
Flynn, Stephen (Aberdeen South) (SNP)
† Fuller, Richard (North East Bedfordshire) (Con)
† Griffith, Andrew (Economic Secretary to the Treasury)
† Howell, Paul (Sedgefield) (Con)
† Jones, Andrew (Harrogate and Knaresborough) (Con)
† Linden, David (Glasgow East) (SNP)
† Maclean, Rachel (Redditch) (Con)
† Milling, Amanda (Cannock Chase) (Con)
† Moore, Robbie (Keighley) (Con)
† Murray, James (Ealing North) (Lab/Co-op)
† Oppong-Asare, Abena (Erith and Thamesmead) (Lab)
† Shelbrooke, Alec (Elmet and Rothwell) (Con)
† Smith, Nick (Blaenau Gwent) (Lab)
† Stephenson, Andrew (Lord Commissioner of His Majesty's Treasury)
† Twist, Liz (Blaydon) (Lab)
† Vaz, Valerie (Walsall South) (Lab)
ClerksBethan Harding, Amna Bokhari, Committee Clerks
† attended the Committee
Public Bill CommitteeTuesday 22 November 2022
(Afternoon)
[Mr Peter Bone in the Chair]
UK Infrastructure Bank Bill [Lords]
“, and
(c) the effectiveness and scale of private and other third-party capital attracted to investments by the Bank.”
It is a particular pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Bone. Had you been with us this morning you would have witnessed a series of debates between the Minister, me and, on occasion, Opposition Members about the importance of the bank, with references to its ability to attract private capital from outside and to the importance of its achieving a financial return for its shareholders, who, I remind right hon. and hon. Members, are the taxpayers, through the choosing of the Government.
Amendment 14 relates to reviews of the bank’s effectiveness and impact. In previous discussions the Minister said—on balance, I think quite rightly—that there was sufficient power in the Government’s ability to provide a framework of strategic priorities and plans and, if necessary, to put directions in place for those objectives not to be included in the Bill. He said there was enough flexibility for the Government to provide a response by other means, which I accept.
In clause 9, however, we are trying to look at the bank’s effectiveness and impact. We are reviewing not just the bank’s homework but the directions provided by the Treasury and His Majesty’s Government over that period. That is underlined by subsection (1), which makes reference to “an independent person”. My amendment would amplify subsection (1)(b) by adding a specific provision on
“the effectiveness and scale of private and other third-party capital attracted to investments by the Bank.”
To reiterate some points that are relevant to the review —the hon. Member for Erith and Thamesmead has agreed with at least one of them, and perhaps more—there are concerns that the bank might spread itself too thinly with regard to where and how it might seek investments, all the way from early-stage investing, through growth capital, to mature investing. It is therefore important that the review by the independent person takes into consideration the efficiency of capital allocated between those various tasks or parts of the investing spectrum.
It is important that we understand the investment structures that are in place. What I have in mind—and I am interested to hear the Minister’s observations—is the fact that the bank is trying to attract external capital to achieve some of our climate change and levelling-up goals. For climate change goals, the backstop provider of the gap in any funding if the private sector does not provide, if we wish to achieve our policy objective, is the UK taxpayer. Right now, in the main Chamber Members are discussing the autumn statement. Members on both sides of the Committee are aware that we are pledging increases in taxation, expenditure and borrowing, notwithstanding additional pressures that achieving net zero will place on taxpayers. It is therefore crucial, if the bank is to play an effective role, that we are vigilant in understanding the burden left at the end of its efforts on the taxpayer, and we should seek to minimise it. My amendment seeks to put pressure on the independent person to look at that objective. Those are the main priorities of my amendment and I look forward to hearing the Minister’s response.
As the hon. Gentleman briefly stated, the clause sets out requirements for reviews of the bank’s effectiveness and impact. In particular, it states:
“The Chancellor must appoint an independent person to carry out reviews of…the effectiveness of the Bank in delivering its objectives, and…its impact in relation to climate change and regional and local economic growth (including the extent to which its investments in particular projects or types of projects have encouraged additional investment in those projects or types of project by the private sector).”
The independent person must share those reports with the Treasury, which must then publish the reports and lay a copy before Parliament. I welcome that there will be performance reviews of the bank. Given the importance of its objectives, it is right that its ability to meet its aims is evaluated. We will get to the frequency of the reports later. I am sure I do not need to reveal to Committee members that we think the current proposed frequencies are inadequate.
Amendment 14, tabled by the hon. Member for North East Bedfordshire, would add a third element to the reports: the independent person would have to consider the effectiveness and scale of private and other third-party capital attracted to investments by the bank. We have already discussed the concept of additionality—the idea that the bank should be adding value and crowding in private sector investment. Clause 9(1)(b) already makes reference to additional investment, so I am confident that that is already covered by the Bill.
However, in this case, I would like to join hands with the hon. Member for Erith and Thamesmead and, regrettably, confirm that it is my view that clause 9(1)(b), which already talks about the degree to which investments in particular projects or types of projects have encouraged additional investment in those projects or types of projects by the private sector, will go a long way to accomplishing what my hon. Friend wants. I am happy to write to him on what I consider to be the effectiveness of the clause and explore whether there is some value to be added in changing it, but it is my position, as it is that of the hon. Member for Erith and Thamesmead, that clause 9(1)(b) already does that.
My hon. Friend the Member for North East Bedfordshire should be reassured that the Government are setting up this institution with great foresight as to how we keep it accountable. The mere fact that we are legislating at its inception for an independent review to be carried out is a very progressive thing. We are trying to ensure that all our arm’s length bodies are as effective as possible. Speaking personally, I think it would be an innovation for every other arm’s length body to have to have independent reviews at frequent intervals.
I hope that my hon. Friend will agree that the wording of the Bill is already sufficiently broad to cover what he is seeking and accept my assurances to explore whether it should be changed, and that he will not press his amendment to a vote.
Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
“(c) the geographic spread of the businesses and bodies the Bank invests in, and
(d) the ownership of the businesses and bodies the Bank invests in.”.
This amendment requires reviews of the Bank’s effectiveness and impact to consider the location and ownership of the businesses and bodies it invests in.
It might be helpful if I give the background to the amendment. Labour wants to strengthen British industry, supply chains and our industrial strategy. That is why we have proposed amendment 23, which would require reviews of the bank to consider the geographic spread of the businesses and bodies that the bank invests in, and their ownership.
I was concerned to read research by Open Democracy that found that the bank has so far pledged nearly all its cash to firms with offshore owners, including some linked to tax havens and repressive regimes. That was an independent report, not carried out by my party, but by Open Democracy. We want the benefits of the UK Infrastructure Bank to be seen here in the UK, with home-grown renewables such as offshore wind, solar, nuclear, hydrogen and tidal power. We want to work with businesses to crowd in private funding and work with unions to ensure high-quality jobs. I am sure the whole Committee can agree on that.
We know that this could be a national enterprise. We have a world-leading offshore wind industry in Scotland and on the east coast, hydrogen in the north-west and Teesside, nuclear power in the south-east, and solar power in the south and midlands. That can only be realised if investment stays here in the UK. A lack of domestic champions has compromised our security and stalled progress.
In respect of—
“further develop its understanding of where infrastructure needs are greatest so that it routinely informs investment decisions and prioritises them.”
Surely such geographical reporting would help the bank with its work.
Question put, That the amendment be made.
“12 months and the second report within 24 months of the day on which this Act comes into force”.
Amendment 21, in clause 9, page 4, line 21, leave out “7” and insert “4”.
This amendment requires an initial report of the Bank’s effectiveness to take place within 4 years after the Act comes into force, rather than the current 7.
Amendment 16, in clause 9, page 4, line 24, leave out “7” and insert “2”.
Amendment 22, in clause 9, page 4, line 24, leave out “7” and insert “5”.
This amendment requires reviews of the Bank’s effectiveness to take place every five years after the initial review, rather than the current 7.
This group, including my amendments 15 and 16, relates to the timing and frequency of reports that will be provided. My amendments focus on the start of the UK Infrastructure Bank’s existence. Essentially, my question is: does the Minister feel that there will be enough transparency and exposure around the bank as it sets up its guiding principles, begins its work, puts its board together and starts to put some flesh on the bones of its investment profile?
My concern is that we will be waiting a bit too long if we wait for seven years to have any influence at all on the way in which the bank is being structured and is moving. Will it be going in the right direction? Essentially, we will not know until the next decade, and that will be well on our way to the time at which Parliament has set the objective of achieving net zero.
Amendment 15 suggests that we should have a report within the first 12 months, and a second report after 24 months. Those two reports would provide independent understanding about what the board and the bank leadership itself are doing at such crucial stages. Amendment 16 tries to do something similar in clause 9(5). The Government propose that subsequent reports must be made every seven years, while my suggestion is that they should be every two years.
I am probably willing to concede to the Government that, after the first couple of years, my proposal would probably involve a bit too much oversight over the board. The board must be allowed to do its job, so someone looking over its shoulders every two years is probably a bit too much. I am therefore minded not to press that point, but I will be interested to hear the Government’s thinking, particularly on the first two reports.
I share the hon. Member’s concerns, because the initial review of the bank will be published within seven years of the Bill coming into force, and subsequent reviews will be published at intervals of no more than seven years. Those timeframes are shocking, particularly given that the Government’s original intention was for the initial report to be published in 10 years’ time.
I point out to the Minister that the levelling up missions are due to be met by 2030 and the net zero target by 2050, so a review in seven years’ time would miss the first of those targets. I would be interested to hear from the Minister how, without that review, those targets will be met.
Amendment 21 would provide that the initial review would be published within four years of the Bill coming into force, while amendment 22 would see subsequent reviews published every five years. That would enable the bank to grow, improve and ensure that it is meeting its objectives. I noted that the hon. Member for North East Bedfordshire may not press his amendments, so hopefully he finds ours to be more appropriate.
We have to get this right. The most important thing is that the bank is equipped to deliver the outcomes that we seek by deploying its capital in pursuit of its statutory objectives. I do not want us to trip over a particular interval when, inevitably, a number of reviews will be ongoing. Whether the right hon. Lady likes it or not, the undertaking that I am going to give is to come back on this. The Government have already moved in respect of clause 9(5)—from 10 years to seven. I hear from Members on both sides of the Committee that there is concern that seven years is still too long, and I undertake to come back on that.
I want to pin the Minister down a little on what he means when he talks about coming back. Would that be coming back in the form of writing to the hon. Member for Erith and Thamesmead, or coming back during the Bill’s remaining stages? I want to clarify exactly what he means, because some of us have fallen foul of such behaviour by Ministers before.
Recently, I was briefly the incumbent of the roads portfolio, which is obviously an important part of infrastructure. The average time from scheme idea to spades in the ground actually exceeds the seven years that is provided for in the Bill. While I am extremely sympathetic to the points made by my hon. Friend the Member for North East Bedfordshire about ensuring that we do not go too long without checking, I am also sympathetic to the idea that we need to be able to operationalise the schemes. Does the Minister agree that the key to getting the seven years down is the reform of planning legislation? We cannot guarantee an investment until the development consent orders are cleared.
“At the end of May 2022, the Bank had made five deals”.
Can the Minister update us on how many deals had been made by the bank up until, say, October this year?
Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Amendment proposed: 21, in clause 9, page 4, line 21, leave out “7” and insert “4”.—(Abena Oppong-Asare.)
This amendment requires an initial report of the Bank’s effectiveness to take place within 4 years after the Act comes into force, rather than the current 7.
Question put, That the amendment be made.
Question put, That the amendment be made.
Question proposed, That the clause stand part of the Bill.
We have talked about the review period. The statutory independent review will be in addition to the UKIB framework document, which will be reviewed after the Bill receives Royal Assent and at regular intervals thereafter, in addition to effectiveness reviews from the Cabinet Office, to which all public bodies are subject. The strategic review in 2024 will cover the general progress to date of the UKIB and its capital position, the implementation of the financial framework, the UKIB’s delegation limits and the return on equity. It will be additional to the financial framework, which will be reviewed from time to time after the strategic review. Given all of that and the debate about the period and my undertaking to come back on clause 9(5) and revisit what is the appropriate time, given colleagues’ concerns that seven years is too long, I recommend that the clause stand part of the Bill.
I hope that there will be opportunity for parliamentary scrutiny and discussion following report publications. I have noted—and I am sure the Minister is aware—that the Public Accounts Committee is currently conducting a review of the establishment of the UK Infrastructure Bank. It is a shame that the recommendations may not come early enough to influence the Bill, but its work demonstrates that the importance of evaluation. We have spoken about this topic at length today, so we will not oppose clause 9.
Question put and agreed to.
Clause 9 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Amendments made: 6, in clause 10, page 4, line 32, at end insert—
““appropriate national authority” means—
(a) the Scottish Ministers,
(b) the Welsh Ministers, or
(c) the Department for Infrastructure in Northern Ireland.”
This amendment would define “appropriate national authority”.
Amendment 9, in clause 10, page 5, line 4, leave out the definition of “relevant public authorities” and insert—
““public authorities” means local authorities, Northern Ireland departments and any other person exercising functions of a public nature.”—(Andrew Griffith.)
See the explanatory statement for Amendment 8.
Clause 10
Interpretation
Question proposed, That the clause stand part of the Bill.
Government amendment 7.
Clause 11 stand part.
The Bill contains provisions stating that the bank is able to provide loans to relevant public authorities, and the clause defines public authorities to include Northern Ireland Departments, as well as local authorities in England, Scotland and Wales, and district councils in Northern Ireland. That is indicative of our commitment that the bank should work to deliver collaboratively and UK-wide, taking into account different infrastructure financing landscapes.
Government amendment 7 is a privilege amendment, as is standard for a Bill that begins its passage in the Lords and concerns matters of public finance. A privilege amendment was passed; given the Bill is now in the Commons, I have tabled an amendment to remove it that is purely technical. Clause 11 confirms that the Bill extends to England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, and the point at which it will come into force, which will be two months after Royal Assent.
Clause 11 is a short clause concerning the extent and commencement of the Bill, as well as providing its short title. It stipulates that the Act extends to England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. The legislation comes into force two months after the date on which it is passed, and it is to be cited as the UK Infrastructure Bank Act 2022. Government amendment 7 simply removes the privilege amendment inserted by the Lords, and is a procedural necessity that we have no reason to oppose.
Question put and agreed to.
Clause 10, as amended, accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 11
Extent, Commencement and short title
Amendment made: 7, in clause 11, page 5, line 11, leave out subsection (4).—(Andrew Griffith.)
This amendment would remove the privilege amendment inserted by the House of Lords.
Clause 11, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
New Clause 1
Businesses and bodies the Bank invests in
“(1) The Bank must publish an annual report setting out—
(a) the geographical spread of businesses and bodies it invests in, and
(b) the ownership of the businesses and bodies it invests in.
(2) The Bank must prepare and publish a “Good Jobs” plan for all businesses and bodies it invests in, which requires the business or body to improve productivity, pay, jobs and living standards.”—(Abena Oppong-Asare.)
This new clause ensures that the Bank considers the location and ownership of the businesses and bodies it invests in and only invests in businesses and bodies who create “Good Jobs” plans to improve productivity, pay, jobs and living standards.
Brought up, and read the First time.
New clause 1 supports amendment 23. It would require the bank to publish an annual report setting out the geographical spread of the businesses and bodies it invests in, and their ownership. To be clear, amendment 23 required the independent review, conducted over longer time frames, to consider those points. Our new clause requires the bank to report annually on those matters.
Subsection (2) of new clause 1 would require the bank to publish and invest in a good jobs plan for all businesses and bodies, which requires the business or body to improve productivity, pay, jobs and living standards. Before the Minister objects, I will say that the wording might be familiar to members of the Committee, particularly Conservative members, because it is the same wording they voted to remove from the Bill earlier in Committee. The wording will be familiar to Conservative Committee members because it is the first mission of the Government’s levelling-up agenda. Given their voting record in this Committee so far, I am not sure it is something they are committed to any more, but I am sure they can agree that they want the UK Infrastructure Bank to create highly-skilled, well-paid jobs in their constituencies and across the country. I know that constituents in Erith and Thamesmead want to see better job opportunities, whether for young people or older people who are looking to reskill and retrain.
As I said earlier, we do not believe in growth for growth’s sake. We believe in growth because it creates jobs and improves living standards. With fairer choices, we see our economy growing again, powered by the talent and effort of millions of working people and thousands of our businesses. Our new clause would ensure that the bank plays its part in its mission, creating new industries across the country and working hand in hand with businesses to create jobs for the future. Before the Committee concludes, I want to take the opportunity to make some closing remarks and thank some people.
As discussed earlier, the nature of an infrastructure investment means that it is difficult to hide. They tend to be fairly visible and tangible and we would all be able to work out exactly where those millions of pounds of capital had been deployed. I reassure hon. Members that the bank is subject to freedom of information requests in the usual way, which I understand is a painless process by which one can readily find out information. [Interruption.] The legislation was not brought in by this Government, so if it is deficient, it is not on our watch.
The new clause contains two elements, so I will turn briefly to the other point nested in it, which is the good jobs plan. The bank is already committed to pursuing good environmental, social, resilience and governance policy. We do not feel that adding extra statutory requirements in this particular case is the right decision. The bank will be reporting on the number of jobs created as one of its key performance indicators and will be working up measures on productivity as well as setting out the impact of its assessments, on which we will all hold it to account. With that, I ask the Opposition to withdraw their new clause.
Question put, That the clause be read a Second time.
I thank the Minister for answering our questions. I am disappointed that some of our amendments have been voted against, but I accept that the Minister is going to look at some of our recommendations on some clauses, in terms of the annual review. That is very important. Seven years is a very long time.
I thank the hon. Member for North East Bedfordshire for his detailed analysis and his amendments. I thank the Chairs of both sittings, Mr Davies and Mr Bone, who have guided the Committee with skill. At times, you have been very firm, but rightly so. I thank the Clerks, Amna Bokhari and Bethan Harding, who have been invaluable. I thank colleagues, including my hon. Friend the Member for Ealing North and our Whip, my hon. Friend the Member for Blaydon, and look forward to seeing what comes out of this next.
Bill, as amended, to be reported.
UKIBB01 Green Alliance
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